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May 25 12 3:16 AM

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freeman4:



The “Rapture”, true or false?

There are so many who are not overly concerned about all that may happen in the near future simply because they say that they will be “Raptured off ” or that is Christ will come and take them away before this all comes about. If that is what one wants to believe that is their choice, but that does not mean that it will happen. There has been a conspiracy working toward getting individuals geared for this “Rapture” and it will come to haunt them in the end.

I know that what will be given here will more than likely not change any individuals thinking on this matter, but it has got to be addressed just the same. Satan is the greatest counter fitter that has ever lived and has many in his grasp at this time. And no, I am not saying that those individuals are of Satan but I am saying that he does have a controlling grasp over many individuals now.

As we are hearing much talk about WW111 and that it may be very close, there are those who believe that they will be taken out of harms way before all of this happens. They believe that Jesus Christ will come and take them away from, up to Heaven before it does happen.

But what does Scripture really have to say about this and will what they look for really come to pass? I want to show how this is something that people should be overly concerned about and how they very well will be caught in a trap. The truth is that individuals need to be preparing for what is coming and that their family will be in terrible condition if they do not seek out the truth and ask God for His guidance in this matter.


1Th 4:16

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.


No indication in the above scripture of when Jesus will return, just that He will.

1Th 4:17

Then we who are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.

All it states is that those who are His Elect will meet Him in the air. It is I hope obvious to all that They and Jesus will not stay there in the air and will always be with Him in the air. If that be the case, I want no part of it. But that will not be the final stopping place. But I will get to that later.

Mat 25:31


When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

Please notice when Jesus does return it will be upon His throne, but where?

Mat 25:32


And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth [his] sheep from the goats:

Now, I can tell you one thing you will not have in Heaven and that is Nations. They are on the Earth. His throne will be here on this Earth and not in Heaven as some speculate.

I want you to notice Matt. Ch 24: very close.

Mat 24:16


Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

When events get really bad God has given instructions for those in Judea to flee to the Mountains. Go and get away from the trouble that is coming.

Mat 24:20


But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

God is giving advise to individuals on what they should do in that area, and that He hoped it would not be on a Sabbath day for them to have to take that journey for it was forbidden to travel at that time.

Mat 24:21


For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

This is talking about the time we now live. About our Generation although some may not believe it. It is called “Great Tribulation”, great distress on all people. This is where we come to the truth about the “ Rapture” and we will show that it will not happen as has been taught.

Mat 24:27


For as the lightning come’s out of the east, and shines even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

One will notice when Jesus Christ will return, it will not be secret in nature, but will be as lightening in the sky. He will come with great power and might, not as a tip toeing whispering nothing.

But at what time will this happen? Notice.

Mat 24:29


Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

When will this happen? Immediately after the what? After the Great Tribulation.

But notice, Jesus has not come at this time, during the Great Tribulation, but after it.

Mat 24:30


And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

And then when? And then AFTER THE GREAT TRIBULATION. How plain this is.

Now notice what happen next.

Mat 24:31


And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Jesus Christ comes after the Great Tribulation And not before.

Many are being given the wrong information and are heading for tremendous hardships and do not know it.

Revelations describe a time that those who trust in Him and are His Elect will be in a place of protection and it will be on this Earth, not in Heaven when the Tribulation does happen. The rest of mankind will have to face The Beast System.

Notice:


Rev 12:14

The woman was given the two wings of a great eagle, so that she might fly to the place prepared for her in the desert, where she would be taken care of for a time, times and half a time, out of the serpent's reach.

Women in this regard is the End Time Church or Gods Elect. They will escape the Tribulation by preparing from what Gods word has given them the knowledge of doing.

Just to set back and say “ God will take care of us” and whisk us away is not a good thing to do for your Children. There are events coming that you do not want them to go through and what you believe about a Rapture is not going to help at all. God has given instruction all through His word but the problem is individuals do not want to hear the truth. They want smooth things taught to them. Things that fit their life style. They don't want to hear that they will have to change their way of thinking to follow God, they want what they have been taught and nothing else will do.

And yes, we can know when time is near if we will just let God guide us. But First we have to seek Him and all His ways and then He will show us the true way.

Time is on the door step when all of man kind will fall because of not following God and His ways. It is not to late to repent and to be part of the Elect. Think about it.

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#2 [url]

Jun 12 12 8:05 AM



11/12/06 From Our Lord and Savior, Jesus The Christ - A Letter Given to Timothy, For All Those Who Have Ears to Hear
Many Are Called, Few Are Chosen... *All Shall Be Saved[1]. The First Harvest Shall Be Lowly... The Second, Plenteous.

Timothy, write as I speak, and hear and understand The Lord’s purpose. I have sent you out among My sheep, as a shepherd who has no experience nor knowledge of My flock. Yet from your birth, yea, before your formation, you were ordained as a beacon and a light, a prophet and an enemy to men. I have called you out as an empty vessel of dishonor, of which I have cleansed and filled unto great honor, a man who shall be greatly hated of men and the world. Even men of My own fold shall come to hate you and cast stones at you. I have called you out of the world, and I send you back into the world... Even among My own church shall I send you. Lo, you are of My body, but separate from that which is called My body by men. Behold, Timothy, I have sent you out amongst wolves and sheep, of which both shall bite at you and wish to trample you. You are sent to speak the Truth Absolute, and to make war in My members... To make enemies, not friends. You shall slay your brother in his heart with the sword, which is the Word of My mouth. In one hand, a sharp sword with two edges, which is the Truth Absolute; and in the other, a trumpet to sound the warning. 
Here is wisdom: God is just in everything. And if The Father’s justice is not a respecter of persons, then it shall surely come to pass in these last few short days (years)... Those who would be first shall be last, and those who were last shall be first. 
For what shall I do, and what shall I say, to these who speak My name continually, invoking My words from Scripture and My statutes, and then going in that self-same hour and disobeying them? Shall any man, who thinks himself righteous because he knows My name, be taken out of The Lord’s day as a reward for his disobedience and high-mindedness?... Surely not! What of all these men, who speak My name and My Word continually, in the judgment of others, to exalt their own selves? Shall I then reward them for their lack of humility, exalting them to Heaven, though they stand firm for themselves and not Me?... Surely not! Of My servants, I require all humility and meekness and faith, rightly dividing My Word unto edification of their brothers and sisters, not in justification of themselves, by themselves, for their own churches who do not keep My Commandments nor honor My statutes.

Thus says The Lord to all servants, who call of themselves servants in My name: Do you really know Me? Do you abide in Me?... And if I abide in you, then where is My fruit of My own Spirit of which I have given you?... I have not seen it! What have you done with My gifts? My lost sheep, where have you laid them?... They lie next to your faith, which has also been misplaced. Why do you now come against Me? For all you have done shall be accounted to you, unless you repent and cast away these filthy robes of arrogance and pride. You have asked of Me forgiveness, in My name, and I have washed you in My own blood... You are now married unto Me, beloved! How is it that you now play the harlot and return to those same things of which I have forgiven you? Beloved, The Lord does not change! Yet you have endeavored to change My Word to suit your own selfishness, to hold onto that which is abomination in the eyes of God! Shall I then gather you up and reward you for your error?... Surely not! Are you saved in spite of your error?... Yes, The Lord does not lie to His sheep. But remember this: The Lord will surely correct and discipline those He loves, making His bride fit for her Husband when He returns for her. 
My servants, hold your lamps up so I may see your faces! Why have you poured out the pure oil I gave you and intermingled it with the dirt upon the ground? Your lamps will not light, they have gone out. Hurry and buy some new oil, quickly, from those who I have sent to sell you of the pure oil, which I have given them. 

Thus says The Lord, who died and is alive forevermore... Amen: I have sent out the watchmen, My prophets, of whom you shall know by their fruits. Woe to those, who do not embrace their words and give heed to their correction, for it would have been better for you if you had never met them, nor heard them, and remained in your ignorance. Lo, you have heard them, and now you are bound by their word, a cord you shall not cut, for theirs is the Word of God brought forth through their own mouths. Behold, it is I , even I, who speaks! So then, all those, who come against them, come against Me. And those, who stone them by rock or word, even these shall I not gather, for I shall leave them in the midst of the fire, left unto refinement... A great humbling. There shall be great wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Thus says your Master, your Teacher, the Bearer of your cross, of which I carried because of My love for you: Servants, you stand too tall, your girth is too wide, you are unable to pass... For small is the gate and narrow is the way into Heaven. NO MAN, great in stature, may enter... Called Christian or otherwise. For it is the humble, penitent man who shall enter. No name, nor mere proclamation or work, shall bring you to My Father’s house, for I search the hearts and minds! Do I require, then, perfection?... Certainly not. I require a sincere, loving heart, a man fully converted in his inward parts, a sincere striving to obey, a man who continually comes to Me in total love and trust when he stumbles, a man of My own Spirit, a man after My own heart. 


So beloved, and all those who call themselves by My name, 
I ask you again, do you really love Me?... 

Then follow Me. 



Beloved, who call of themselves by My own name, do you really love Me?...
Then obey My Word. Follow Me. 

Beloved, who call themselves by My own name, do you really love Me?...
Then leave everything and follow Me. 

Stop breaking My heart and giving heed to the devil... Follow Me!



I have always loved you. Even from the beginning, I have loved you... I am your Maker, your Carpenter, your Father. Let go, beloved, let go of your pride, let go of this world, let go and come to Me in Truth... Your salvation is assured.
I know all, who are in My Kingdom, given Me of The Father. I know who all of you are, I know who you are to become. Hear Me, beloved. Turn not to the right, nor the left, stay focused on Me... I am the Truth, the Way and the Life, the Path you must follow. I do not change... I am the same yesterday, today and all tomorrows to come. What I have written let no man change. Rather, follow Me as I have said and not as you would have Me say. Keep The Father’s Commandments, as He had written them in stone by His own finger... In number, ten. Keep them all, remember them all, and do them according to how they are written, not as man has rewritten them, and it shall be credited unto you for righteousness. I have freed you from the curse of the Law; I have not freed you from obedience to the Law. Rather, I have given you the means, by My own Spirit, to keep the Law. Oh beloved, why do you not understand My speech? Why do you not love Me? Why have you lost the desire to follow Me? My love has not changed, yet you have changed, becoming lords unto yourselves. Beloved, keep what The Father has given you... Stop desecrating His Sabbaths! The Law stands forever, and all that is contained therein also stands. Even from Sabbath to Sabbath, in the Kingdom, shall the nations come up to Jerusalem and worship Me. So then, My beloved, follow Me, and make our love perfect in obedience, and embrace My prophets, and separate yourselves from those who are false, who deny My name by all they do. For any man, who embraces those who deny Me, embraces he who is against Me. And any, who embrace those I send, he also shall My Father embrace and hide in His Sanctuary. 
Beloved, you shall surely know My prophets by their fruit, of which the devil can not duplicate... Imitate, yes... Duplicate, no. Thus shall you know them by their fruits and by their continual trumpeting of My name and My coming. I am in them, and they in Me. Woe to any man who comes against them in these last days: To the wicked, they shall be burned and consumed; and to the false-righteous, these shall be left standing where they ought not to be... Left in bewilderment and tears... Abased for their arrogance, pride, judgements, persecutions, false teachings, evil surmisings, envy, foolish-talking and wrath. Yet shall they be saved, as one being refined by the fires of The Father’s correction and discipline, but not falling under His judgement because of My name... Rather, coming into My Kingdom by great tribulation of the world and men, taken through by the Right Hand of God... Some martyred to the glory of God, others hidden in the desert for a time, times and a half of time. Many shall behold the angels of Heaven ascending and descending upon The Son of Man in those days. Timothy, sift My wheat by all I have given you!


The Trumpet is blowing, the bride is being prepared... the wedding supper approaches.

The seals are placed in the hands of The Holy One of Israel... 
The Great Day of The Lord God Almighty is upon you.
Look up, your redemption draws nigh.

My people, remember, God is just in everything. 


Amen.





1. ↑ [*Note, regarding the title where it states, "All Shall Be Saved": Not all will be saved... Only those who call on The Messiah's name, the humble and penitent, will be saved. Some will escape, while others will be left unto refinement in the Day of the Lord. Yet all, who call on the name of The Lord, will be saved (Joel 2:32). This Letter was addressed to all those who trust in The Messiah, Jesus The Christ, YahuShua HaMashiach; and indeed, all who are truly converted in their hearts, in whom The Lord sees of Himself, will be saved... "for Love has saved them".]

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#4 [url]

Oct 10 12 12:50 PM


And then when? And then AFTER THE GREAT TRIBULATION. How plain this is.

Now notice what happen next.




 

Mat 24:31




And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
 

-=freeman

 
 
 Hello freeman:

The ELECT from the four winds, is Israel, but those from one end of heaven to the other, are the saints [Church]. Otherwise, please explain their presence in heaven.

In addition, how is it the saints are seen returning with Jesus in Zech.14:4-5; Jude 14 as well as in Rev.19:14 if they were not raptured before the tribulation began, as Paul writes in 2 Thes.2:1-8?

What is Jesus talking about in Lk.21:36 when He said to,
"Watch and pray always, that you may escape all these things...," when He was concluding His Olivet discourse about the tribulation?

What did Jesus mean when He said, "Sonce you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world?"  Rev.3:10  NIV.  Meaning the great tribulation.

What did Paul mean when he wrote, "and to wait from His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead - Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath."  1 Thes.1:10  NIV.

And in 1 Thes.5:9:  "For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath [the great tribulation] but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ."  And what was Paul referring to here?

What was Jesus talking about in Jn.14:1-4 and 28?  That Paul picked up on in 1 Thes.4:15:  "According to the Lord's own word...," and goes on to tell us in vs 17 we will be CAUGHT UP together with them [the dead in Christ] in the clouds, to MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR."  From where He will take us to our Father in heaven as He promised us in Jn.14:2-4 and 28.


For the full Scriptural teaching of Jesus, Paul and John about the pre-trib rapture of the Church. review the following:

http://deeperwalk.lefora.com/2011/10/03/the-scriptural-teachings-of-the-pre-trib-rapture-o/#post6



Quasar86 

"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." Jn.14:6.

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#5 [url]

Oct 11 12 7:32 AM

"What did Jesus mean when He said, "Sonce you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world?" Rev.3:10 NIV. Meaning the great tribulation."

The above is a quote for you, Please notice Rev. 12: This is talking about the Church on this Earth being protecdted. There are so many Churches and they all believe something diffrent, that they are all going to heaven their way.

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#6 [url]

Oct 11 12 11:25 AM

Freeman,  They all believe in their own version of the gospel not the true gospel they want their ears tickled and like the old burger king commercial have it your way and you know what no matter what you say they won't believe it for it will not tickle ears and to argue is pointless. Like unto the days of Noah they will not accept truth and when the disaster strikes then and only then will they say ABBA father and Oh Lord Yeshua and he will say depart from me I do not know you.

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#7 [url]

Oct 17 12 6:38 AM

"What did Jesus mean when He said, "Sonce you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world?" Rev.3:10 NIV. Meaning the great tribulation."
The above is a quote for you, Please notice Rev. 12: This is talking about the Church on this Earth being protecdted. There are so many Churches and they all believe something diffrent, that they are all going to heaven their way.

-freeman4


First of all, my apology for not catching the typo in the above before signing off which should read as follows:

"What did Jesus mean when He said, "SINCE you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world?"  Rev.3:10  NIV.  Meaning the great tribulation.

In the second place, why not answer the questions I asked in my last post rather than offering opinion.  I would like to see any of you prove the Scriptures I posted supporting a pre-trib rapture of the Church to be false.  Otherwise, consider the probability yours might be false instead.

3.  My response to your Rev.12 claim is this:  There is no possibility of the Church going through the tribulation for the following reasons:  1. Jesus angels 'gathering them from one end of the heavens to the other,' in Mt.24:31.  2. The Bride [Church] is in heaven for the marriage to the Lamb [Jesus] in Rev.19:7-8 while Israel is going through the tribulation on earth, as recorded in Dan.9:27; Mt.24; Mk.13 and Lk.21.

4.  The saints of Rev.13:7, including all of those in Rev.6:9-11; Rev.7:9-17 are those who will be brought to the Lord by the 144,000 Israelites God will place on the earth to preach the everlasting Gospel to those who go through the tribulation in the absence of the raptured Church.

5.  The saints [Church] are seen returning with Jesus in His second coming, from heaven, in Zech.14:4-5; Jude 14 and in Rev.19:14, and therefore cannot possibly be going through the coming seven year tribulation.

Your comments are invited.


Quasar86

 



"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." Jn.14:6.

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#8 [url]

Oct 18 12 4:23 AM

Quasar;

It does not matter what is posted, you are going to dis credit it.

Mat 24:29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.

Mat 24:30 "Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat
24:31
"And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Please notice that Jesus does not come until AFTER THE GREAT TRIBULATION. That Hsi Angles do not gather the elect until after then. I am sorry you are not able to understand this but you soon will.

freeman4:


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#9 [url]

Oct 20 12 7:15 PM

Quasar;
It does not matter what is posted, you are going to dis credit it.

Mat 24:29"Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.

Mat 24:30"Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. Mat

24:31"And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Please notice that Jesus does not come until AFTER THE GREAT TRIBULATION. That Hsi Angles do not gather the elect until after then. I am sorry you are not able to understand this but you soon will.
freeman4:

-freeman4



No freeman, the posts I have made come directly from the Scriptures which I generously share with others.  Scriptures do not discredit Scriptures ever!

When you review Jesus Revelation He gave to John, you will find the Chronological order of end times events of His second coming, to begin with His landing on the Mount of Olives in Zech.14:4-5, with His saints [Church] from heaven.  confirmed in Jude 14 and in Rev.19:14.  In the latter, you will see all of us who belong to Christ will be returning with Him in His ARMIES from heaven.  That consist of His angels, according to Mt.24:31 and the entire raptured Church in Rev.19:14 - where Jesus will lead us into the battle of Armageddon to fight the two beasts, the antichrist, the false prophet and the ten horns [nations] allied with them.  The events you can find in Rev.19:11-20.
When Jesus wins the battle of Armageddon, with the armies of the ten nations destroyed and the two beasts thrown into the lake of fire, the seven year tribulation will be over!

Satan will then be thrown into the Abyss for 1,000 years according to Rev.20:1-3 and the first resurrection will take place in Rev.20:4 and 6.  All the participants of the first resurrection will be made priests of God and of Christ, and rule with Him for 1,000 years in His kingdom, the restored kingdom of Israel.

Mt.24:29 is a confirmation of Joel's prophecy in 2:28-32 referred to as the Day of the Lord, which is the seven year tribulation as well as the 70th and final Week of Dan.9:27 and Jacob's trouble of Jer.30:7.  Those cosmic events will all take place DURING the tribulation, as you will find fully delineated during the seven trumpet and seven bowl judgements in Rev.

Mt.24:30 I; Mk.13:26 and Lk.21:27 is a confirmation of Zech.14:4-5; Jude 14 as well as in Rev.19:14 specifically referring to Jesus second coming to the earth, with all His angels and saints [Church], according to Mt.24:31 and Rev.19:14.

Mt.24:31 reveals Jesus sending His angels to gather His ELECT from the four winds [Israel], from one end of heaven to the other [the raptured Church - who return with Him from the marriage in heaven when He comes], according to Rev.19:7-8 and 14.

I trust this will be helpful.


Quasar86



 

"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." Jn.14:6.

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#10 [url]

Oct 7 13 3:27 AM

Mt.24:31 reveals Jesus sending His angels to gather His ELECT from the four winds [Israel], from one end of heaven to the other [the raptured Church - who return with Him from the marriage in heaven when He comes], according to Rev.19:7-8 and 14.

Quasar: you quoted the above scripture.

What are you saying about the scripture that states Christ will not return until after the tribulation? Explain that, you have jumped around that.

Leo:

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